The Borg will prevail

Discussion of technology related topics including news, events, and announcements.

Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby Randicus Draco Albus » January 15th, 2015, 8:27 pm

mean_dean wrote:In other words, considering what seems to be the target market for linux nowadays systemd seems to be a good fit for it.
And whatever follows will also be good fits. The problem with the complaining is that most of the people complaining are complaining about the wrong thing. They vigorously object to systemd while praising everything Linux represents, oblivious to what systemd represents - the bigger future of Linux. The fact that Red Hat's systemd development team is hell-bent on forcing Gentoo to adopt systemd is, in my opinion, a sound indicator of what the future holds.
Klingons are fun, but Romulans are the sexiest women in the galaxy.
User avatar
Randicus Draco Albus
 
Posts: 1497
Joined: September 22nd, 2011, 1:22 pm

Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby cynwulf » January 15th, 2015, 9:50 pm

mean_dean wrote:feeling a little sensationalist today, are we? :D

Not sure hysteria....well...maybe...yea...probably right....will give you that one....

Not at all sensationalist - I know a forum chock full of some good examples... we had plenty over here at one point but they got bored and moved on to spread their FUD to more willing ears elsewhere.

mean_dean wrote:I do not think it is irrational to want to remove software from your system that you do not care for though. That being said, I have no idea why most users give a shit.

You're perhaps missing the point a little. For example:
Code: Select all
$ pkg_info avahi
Information for inst:avahi-0.6.31p13

Comment:
framework for Multicast DNS Service Discovery

Required by:
cups-libs-1.7.4
gtk+2-2.24.24
gvfs-1.20.2

Description:
Avahi is a free, standards-compliant implementation of the Zeroconf
protocols Multicast DNS and DNS-SD.

It is a system which facilitates service discovery on a local network.
This means that you can plug your laptop or computer into a network and
instantly be able to view other people who you can chat with, find
printers to print to or find files being shared.  This kind of
technology is already found in Apple MacOS X (branded Rendezvous,
Bonjour and sometimes Zeroconf) and is very convenient.

Maintainer: Antoine Jacoutot <ajacoutot@openbsd.org>

WWW: http://www.avahi.org/

I have avahi installed. I don't want avahi or use it, but some port maintainer decided it needed to be there. This is OpenBSD after all, you are talking about a tiny number of people compared to those maintaining Debian's vast repos. It's doubtful that if I went to the ports mailing lists and started whinging about it that anyone would be interested. And honestly who can blame them?

This is the contents of the avahi package:
Code: Select all
$ pkg_info -L avahi
Information for inst:avahi-0.6.31p13

Files:
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-client.la
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-client.so.0.0
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-common.la
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-common.so.0.0
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-core.la
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-core.so.0.0
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-glib.la
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-glib.so.0.0
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-gobject.la
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-gobject.so.0.0
/usr/local/lib/libdns_sd.la
/usr/local/lib/libdns_sd.so.0.0
/usr/local/lib/libhowl.la
/usr/local/lib/libhowl.so.0.0
/usr/local/bin/avahi-browse
/usr/local/bin/avahi-browse-domains
/usr/local/bin/avahi-publish
/usr/local/bin/avahi-publish-address
/usr/local/bin/avahi-publish-service
/usr/local/bin/avahi-resolve
/usr/local/bin/avahi-resolve-address
/usr/local/bin/avahi-resolve-host-name
/usr/local/bin/avahi-set-host-name
/usr/local/include/avahi-client/client.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-client/lookup.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-client/publish.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/address.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/alternative.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/cdecl.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/defs.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/domain.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/error.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/gccmacro.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/llist.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/malloc.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/rlist.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/simple-watch.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/strlst.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/thread-watch.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/timeval.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-common/watch.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/corby/buffer.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/corby/channel.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/corby/corby.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/corby/message.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/corby/object.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/corby/orb.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/discovery/discovery.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/discovery/text_record.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/howl.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/rendezvous/rendezvous.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/rendezvous/text_record.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/salt/address.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/salt/debug.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/salt/interface.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/salt/platform.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/salt/salt.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/salt/signal.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/salt/socket.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-howl/salt/time.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-compat-libdns_sd/dns_sd.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-core/core.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-core/log.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-core/lookup.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-core/publish.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-core/rr.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-glib/glib-malloc.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-glib/glib-watch.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-gobject/ga-client.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-gobject/ga-entry-group.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-gobject/ga-enums.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-gobject/ga-error.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-gobject/ga-record-browser.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-gobject/ga-service-browser.h
/usr/local/include/avahi-gobject/ga-service-resolver.h
/usr/local/lib/girepository-1.0/Avahi-0.6.typelib
/usr/local/lib/girepository-1.0/AvahiCore-0.6.typelib
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-client.a
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-common.a
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-core.a
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-glib.a
/usr/local/lib/libavahi-gobject.a
/usr/local/lib/libdns_sd.a
/usr/local/lib/libhowl.a
/usr/local/lib/pkgconfig/avahi-client.pc
/usr/local/lib/pkgconfig/avahi-compat-howl.pc
/usr/local/lib/pkgconfig/avahi-compat-libdns_sd.pc
/usr/local/lib/pkgconfig/avahi-core.pc
/usr/local/lib/pkgconfig/avahi-glib.pc
/usr/local/lib/pkgconfig/avahi-gobject.pc
/usr/local/man/man1/avahi-browse-domains.1
/usr/local/man/man1/avahi-browse.1
/usr/local/man/man1/avahi-publish-address.1
/usr/local/man/man1/avahi-publish-service.1
/usr/local/man/man1/avahi-publish.1
/usr/local/man/man1/avahi-resolve-address.1
/usr/local/man/man1/avahi-resolve-host-name.1
/usr/local/man/man1/avahi-resolve.1
/usr/local/man/man1/avahi-set-host-name.1
/usr/local/man/man5/avahi-daemon.conf.5
/usr/local/man/man5/avahi.hosts.5
/usr/local/man/man5/avahi.service.5
/usr/local/man/man8/avahi-daemon.8
/usr/local/man/man8/avahi-dnsconfd.8
/usr/local/man/man8/avahi-dnsconfd.action.8
/usr/local/sbin/avahi-daemon
/usr/local/sbin/avahi-dnsconfd
/usr/local/share/avahi/avahi-service.dtd
/usr/local/share/avahi/service-types
/usr/local/share/dbus-1/interfaces/org.freedesktop.Avahi.AddressResolver.xml
/usr/local/share/dbus-1/interfaces/org.freedesktop.Avahi.DomainBrowser.xml
/usr/local/share/dbus-1/interfaces/org.freedesktop.Avahi.EntryGroup.xml
/usr/local/share/dbus-1/interfaces/org.freedesktop.Avahi.HostNameResolver.xml
/usr/local/share/dbus-1/interfaces/org.freedesktop.Avahi.RecordBrowser.xml
/usr/local/share/dbus-1/interfaces/org.freedesktop.Avahi.Server.xml
/usr/local/share/dbus-1/interfaces/org.freedesktop.Avahi.ServiceBrowser.xml
/usr/local/share/dbus-1/interfaces/org.freedesktop.Avahi.ServiceResolver.xml
/usr/local/share/dbus-1/interfaces/org.freedesktop.Avahi.ServiceTypeBrowser.xml
/usr/local/share/dbus-1/system-services/org.freedesktop.Avahi.service
/usr/local/share/doc/pkg-readmes/avahi-0.6.31p13
/usr/local/share/examples/avahi/avahi-daemon.conf
/usr/local/share/examples/avahi/avahi-dnsconfd.action
/usr/local/share/examples/avahi/hosts
/usr/local/share/examples/avahi/services/sftp-ssh.service
/usr/local/share/examples/avahi/services/ssh.service
/usr/local/share/examples/dbus-1/avahi-dbus.conf
/usr/local/share/gir-1.0/Avahi-0.6.gir
/usr/local/share/gir-1.0/AvahiCore-0.6.gir
/usr/local/share/locale/bg/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/ca/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/cs/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/da/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/de/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/el/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/en_AU/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/en_CA/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/en_GB/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/en_NZ/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/es/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/fi/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/fo/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/fr/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/gl/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/he/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/hu/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/id/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/it/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/ja/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/ms/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/nl/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/pl/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/pt_BR/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/ro/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/ru/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/sl/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/sr/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/sr@latin/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/sv/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/uk/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/zh_CN/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/usr/local/share/locale/zh_TW/LC_MESSAGES/avahi.mo
/etc/rc.d/avahi_daemon
/etc/rc.d/avahi_dnsconfd

At the bottom of the list are the rc scripts (the init scripts in sysvinit terms).

On my system neither are configured to run. So though avahi is installed, it is not running - and that's what matters.

This is what I don't get with regard to the systemd lib files. They are cruft, they waste disk space, but they are not running daemons so I don't see the problem. They're pulled in due to the nature of Debian's package management. Debian does this a lot - no one notices because no one is talking about it and the tech press are not making a big deal about it. Package management has to be pragmatic, at times it does pull in unneeded stuff (my example above is probably worse than in Debian - as the latter usually breaks a package up into several smaller chunks). What port/package mantainers can't do is cater for "not on my hard disk" zealots, who irrationally don't want a particular lump of binary sitting on their hard disk because they've joined a haters group of foaming at the mouth anti $HATE_OBJECT fanbois.

avahi was written by Lennart Poettering.

Reminds me of iceweasel vs firefox. So many people over the years came up with the same tired argument: "iceweasel is not firefox because Debian patch it". No one bothered to do simple research, no one read up on it, no one extracted the deb or read the changelogs or did anything except read and react to the FUD posted by others. And people wondered why the Debian devs never bothered with the Debian forums?

mean_dean wrote:I do think systemd is the future of linux and will go hand in hand with the kernel. I am starting to think it may be a decent approach to having a standardized core system or at least a good attempt. I am still not sure I want that though. But for people that prefer complete and comfortable environment then systemd is probably a huge leap in making that 'just work' so I have no idea why they would complain. In other words, considering what seems to be the target market for linux nowadays systemd seems to be a good fit for it.

I see no benefits, nor anything good from the what systemd brings to the table. If your distro decides to adopt it and you don't like it, you have the usual choices.

systemd is no different to any other reinvent-windows-ware in the Linux eco system which has been used and accepted for years by the very people now complaining the loudest. The "veteran unix admins" are far too late to the party.
cynwulf
 
Posts: 2548
Joined: April 26th, 2011, 2:46 pm

Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby mean_dean » January 16th, 2015, 2:34 am

cynwulf wrote:You're perhaps missing the point a little.

I dont think so. I think your point is more about the whining and I agree with that. But it almost sounds like you are saying that nobody gets to decide what is installed on their system. I think every user gets to decide what is or is not installed all the way to not having anything installed on their computer at all. But I do not think anyone gets to whine about others work, and insist that someone besides themselves do something about it. I suspect we are on the same page in general but you kind of made it sound like I was one of the irrational ones because I didnt want something on my system.



This is what I don't get with regard to the systemd lib files. They are cruft, they waste disk space, but they are not running daemons so I don't see the problem.

Yep same ol same ol. I do wonder sometimes about libs...about how they may be misused or abused...


Package management has to be pragmatic, at times it does pull in unneeded stuff (my example above is probably worse than in Debian - as the latter usually breaks a package up into several smaller chunks).

Yea I have noticed that openBSD is very crufty, having a little trouble adjusting.... :D



But yea the whining, particularly the somebody-do-something-about-it-for-me whining is ridiculous.


systemd is no different to any other reinvent-windows-ware

That is the benefit. It makes linux a more complete core system, rather than a bunch of seperate parts. Perfect for those that want it that way, just like windows.I do not want that and I do not see anything good about it but for those that want more unified system then obviously unifying a bunch of basic utilities into one is..well...unified...ergo...good


which has been used and accepted for years by the very people now complaining the loudest.

Agreed. That was what I mentioned before...maybe in another thread. This is just the next step in the progression...not a new path by any means. A bit too late to start bitching now.


If your distro decides to adopt it and you don't like it, you have the usual choices.

Yep, do something about it or move on, not start yelling and demanding that someone else do something. But the fairly recent influx of users seems to think they are listened to and have a say in even the most basic of things. That they get to demand that things be changed, or unchanged, as it suites them.
User avatar
mean_dean
 
Posts: 192
Joined: November 30th, 2014, 1:12 pm

Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby Randicus Draco Albus » January 16th, 2015, 3:05 am

mean_dean wrote:But the fairly recent influx of users seems to think they are listened to and have a say in even the most basic of things. That they get to demand that things be changed, or unchanged, as it suites them.

Which of course is a result of the marketing to Windows users. In addition to "You can do everything you do with Windows, but free," there is also the propaganda of "community distributions," where users and developers are a big, happy family. It is to be expected that those people will believe they are now part of the same community that makes the system. Look at Ubuntu's "Sandbox". I wonder how many of the ideas submitted by users are ever implemented, but it is a great marketing tool.

I like to whine, because I am miserable SOB.
Klingons are fun, but Romulans are the sexiest women in the galaxy.
User avatar
Randicus Draco Albus
 
Posts: 1497
Joined: September 22nd, 2011, 1:22 pm

Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby mean_dean » January 16th, 2015, 3:47 am

Randicus Draco Albus wrote:They vigorously object to systemd while praising everything Linux represents, oblivious to what systemd represents - the bigger future of Linux.


Yea, buntards are getting everything they wanted. The ecosystem is catering to them. I don't know wtf they have to complain about!

As far as redhat...ehhh...dont see much sense in pointing the finger at them at least not any more than before.


there is also the propaganda of "community distributions," where users and developers are a big, happy family. It is to be expected that those people will believe they are now part of the same community that makes the system.

And the sad thing is that the users think their job is to complain... :lol:

I like to whine, because I am miserable SOB.

I like to whine a bit too. I think whining is okay as long as you know that nobody but you is responsible for alleviating the cause. ;)
User avatar
mean_dean
 
Posts: 192
Joined: November 30th, 2014, 1:12 pm

Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby cynwulf » January 16th, 2015, 12:14 pm

mean_dean wrote:I dont think so. I think your point is more about the whining and I agree with that. But it almost sounds like you are saying that nobody gets to decide what is installed on their system. I think every user gets to decide what is or is not installed all the way to not having anything installed on their computer at all. But I do not think anyone gets to whine about others work, and insist that someone besides themselves do something about it. I suspect we are on the same page in general but you kind of made it sound like I was one of the irrational ones because I didnt want something on my system.

Everyone gets to decide - it's called building your own system from source.

mean_dean wrote:Yep same ol same ol. I do wonder sometimes about libs...about how they may be misused or abused...

libs are dynamic libraries. They are there so that programs which are built against them, or are built with a certain functionality which links to them, can work as designed. It's likely that if you got the source and rebuilt the package, you could change a few build flags and avoid the linkage, but Debian won't do that - they will strive for the most general compatibility/usefulness rather than the least - so libs you don't want or need get pulled in.

Looking at one controversial example: bsdutils. The dependencies for this were modest in wheezy, but in testing a dependency for libsystemd0 was added. As mentioned earlier libsystemd0 is just a package which installs a lib file, not systemd itself and does not depend on systemd. The lib is there to provide systemd support - interfaces between systemd and the binaries included in the bsdutils package - so if systemd is not installed it's useless and never used. Dy default bsdutils is built with the systemd linkage for all Linux builds.

The alternative would be to have two bsdutils packages - one specifically for systemd and one for all the others. That's not how Debian works. In other words, everyone gets libsystemd0 whether they want it or not (unless you go for kFreeBSD).

So what I'm referring to here are the "not on my hard disk" zealots who see a package with "systemd" in the same and start to panic, procrastinate and spread their FUD far and wide.

For a prime example of such stupidity, look no further: http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php? ... 95#p566209

mean_dean wrote:Yea I have noticed that openBSD is very crufty, having a little trouble adjusting.... :D

It's a trade off - bigger packages get installed, rather than the fragments so common in Debian, but by default services/daemons are not configured to run.

The lack of these fragments means that tons of superfluous lib packages are avoided, so it's possible to avoid those.

The base system and kernel are also very lightweight - far more so than a Linux system.

mean_dean wrote:But yea the whining, particularly the somebody-do-something-about-it-for-me whining is ridiculous.

This has been the case for years. Most of the Linux forums, particularly one you know all too well, are populate by people with a false sense of entitlement, who believe that volunteers owe them a fully functional, free operating system with a graphical installer - and a support forum of volunteers who they treat like paid tech support monkeys.
cynwulf
 
Posts: 2548
Joined: April 26th, 2011, 2:46 pm

Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby mean_dean » January 16th, 2015, 10:35 pm

Everyone gets to decide - it's called building your own system from source.

Thats one way to go about doing it, if you want to control everything. I am too lazy to go that route, I will stick to beating debian with a hammer...at least for now...


libs are dynamic libraries. They are there so that programs which are built against them, or are built with a certain functionality which links to them, can work as designed.

Yep thats what they are but that doesnt mean there is no reason to care about them being on your system. But the concern is pretty minor and I see no reason whatsoever for the average joe to give a shit about them.


So what I'm referring to here are the "not on my hard disk" zealots who see a package with "systemd" in the same and start to panic, procrastinate and spread their FUD far and wide.

I just break out the hammer!

For a prime example of such stupidity, look no further: http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php? ... 95#p566209

I kinda liked that one. You cant beat a leech on the schlong story...


I love it when they blame the software creators themselves rather than blaming the one(s) responsible for implementing/adopting the software. That is something that I really cannot understand.


It's a trade off
Yep. Just gotta get used to it...
User avatar
mean_dean
 
Posts: 192
Joined: November 30th, 2014, 1:12 pm

Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby Randicus Draco Albus » January 16th, 2015, 11:35 pm

cynwulf wrote:So what I'm referring to here are the "not on my hard disk" zealots who see a package with "systemd" in the same and start to panic, procrastinate and spread their FUD far and wide.
mean_dean wrote:Yep thats what they are but that doesnt mean there is no reason to care about them being on your system. But the concern is pretty minor and I see no reason whatsoever for the average joe to give a shit about them.

It is understandable that some people will have a sense of defeat. "systemd libs are already in the system! The end is nigh." Although believing a few innocuous libs in Wheezy means systemd is already present is "inaccurate". Wheezy will never have systemd, so worrying about those three or four unused libs is a little irrational. Just goes to show how once an idea starts to roll, it can build momentum and continue moving under its own power, and systemd is such a scary creature that its shadow will frighten many people.

Does the leech in that anecdote represent systemd? I thought it represents the person who made the post in relation to FDN. :lol:

mean_dean wrote:I love it when they blame the software creators themselves rather than blaming the one(s) responsible for implementing/adopting the software. That is something that I really cannot understand.
It is not an accident. Red Hat is using a good tactic. They keep quiet, while a vocal employee spews his nonsense on blogs under his own name. People identify that person with the project. Since most people are too lazy, and the rest too stupid, to do a little research, they have no idea who is actually behind it. Poettering is too naive to realise he is being used. (And would be a convenient scapegoat if things did not go well.)
Klingons are fun, but Romulans are the sexiest women in the galaxy.
User avatar
Randicus Draco Albus
 
Posts: 1497
Joined: September 22nd, 2011, 1:22 pm

Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby mean_dean » January 17th, 2015, 1:05 am

It is understandable that some people will have a sense of defeat. "systemd libs are already in the system! The end is nigh."

The selinux libs has always gave me the creeps, moreso than systemd libs.

Although believing a few innocuous libs in Wheezy means systemd is already present is "inaccurate".
I seen the devuan list claiming that debian is sneaking systemd into wheezy installs. Cracked me up.


Wheezy will never have systemd,
My wheezy install has it. But then again I did apt-get install it.


Red Hat is using a good tactic. They keep quiet, while a vocal employee spews his nonsense on blogs under his own name. People identify that person with the project.
Neither of those bother me. Heck I always respected redhat, still do, just not as much. Hardly at all anymore actually. But anyway... As far as some turdhead coming up with XYZ, well everyone is welcome to come up with any crappy software. I blame debian for what debian does. Sadly, I am not sure how to determine who actually is debian anymore....
User avatar
mean_dean
 
Posts: 192
Joined: November 30th, 2014, 1:12 pm

Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby Randicus Draco Albus » January 17th, 2015, 1:20 am

mean_dean wrote:I seen the devuan list claiming that debian is sneaking systemd into wheezy installs. Cracked me up.
Another reason to doubt the validity of the project.
Wheezy will never have systemd,
My wheezy install has it. But then again I did apt-get install it.
Why on earth did you do that? :o

I blame debian for what debian does. Sadly, I am not sure how to determine who actually is debian anymore....

A follower, as opposed to the former position of leader.
Klingons are fun, but Romulans are the sexiest women in the galaxy.
User avatar
Randicus Draco Albus
 
Posts: 1497
Joined: September 22nd, 2011, 1:22 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Technical Talk

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron

x