The Borg will prevail

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Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby Buntunub » December 25th, 2014, 6:45 am

Randicus Draco Albus wrote:Once it is in place and the true scope becomes apparent to those would were not paying attention, it is too late to prevent it.


And then you have the vast majority who just don't care. Even if Linux were eventually to morph into a completely proprietary system and totally locked down somehow, the vast majority of users would just not care. You would probably see the rise of, "well, you get what you pay for" tripe thrown about at that point, because most people just don't want to know anything about the OS they use as long as it "just works" with all their games and app store crapware.
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Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby Randicus Draco Albus » December 25th, 2014, 7:11 am

Most will not care as long as the system remains free-of-charge. The people using the system, because they like being free of corporate systems and enjoy being able to do what they want with the system are a small minority of today's users. In fact, when Linux is comprised of one or three locked-down proprietary distributions, most users will be happy, because the system will be more like Windows, but free.
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Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby mean_dean » December 28th, 2014, 2:19 am

mean_dean wrote:PCBSD was too easy! PCBSD is definitely is not the minimal system I prefer but it is nice having a working system to start learning with rather than having to learn just to get the system working. Now to figure out allt hese package choices...ports....pbi....pkg....pkgng....meta-package-manager......


My stint with pcbsd only lasted hours before it got wiped.

I tried openbsd and I do believe I am in love!
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Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby Randicus Draco Albus » December 28th, 2014, 2:35 am

That was my first reaction as well. It works so wonderfully that I was determined to do a lot of learning quickly so I could set the system up the way I want it and use it. Still learning, but almost everything is in place.
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Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby bmc5311 » January 2nd, 2015, 2:24 am

So let me get this straight - as long as I don't install gnome or any gnome dependancies, I'll be unaffected? Or am I reading everything wrong...? Been looking at openbsd, but I'm not excited about setting up the whole enchilada from scratch...
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Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby golinux » January 2nd, 2015, 3:05 am

bmc5311 wrote:So let me get this straight - as long as I don't install gnome or any gnome dependancies, I'll be unaffected?

NO!

bmc5311 wrote:Or am I reading everything wrong...?

Pretty much. Look at this if you haven't before.

bmc5311 wrote:Been looking at openbsd, but I'm not excited about setting up the whole enchilada from scratch...

I hear you. I'm hoping that Devuan gets it together. I'm hopeful. But if not bsd for me too. :(
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Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby Randicus Draco Albus » January 2nd, 2015, 3:58 am

bmc5311 wrote:So let me get this straight - as long as I don't install gnome or any gnome dependancies, I'll be unaffected? Or am I reading everything wrong...?
If it were that simple there would be no problem.

bmc5311 wrote:Been looking at openbsd, but I'm not excited about setting up the whole enchilada from scratch...

golinux wrote:I hear you. I'm hoping that Devuan gets it together. I'm hopeful. But if not bsd for me too. :(
Learning a new system is not an exciting prospect, but may be necessary for some people. In the end it comes down to a cost-benefit analysis -- Do the changes make learning a new system worthwhile? -- If systemd and all that comes with it are too disagreeable, the time and effort of learning a different system is worth it. If one does not like the changes but can live with them, learning a different system might be more trouble than it is worth. Either way, those who are opposed to systemturd have a difficult decision to make: stay with the old and be unhappy or move to the new and be burdened with work. systemd is not going away, so I advise those who truly do not like it and the direction Linux is moving toward to switch now. If one believes there is a chance that moving on will be necessary, it would be better to do so sooner than later. If one must learn, might as well do it now.
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Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby golinux » January 2nd, 2015, 4:13 am

I'm counting on a lateral move to Devuan. Comfortable familiarity without systemd. No decision needs to be made immediately.
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Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby golinux » January 2nd, 2015, 4:55 am

bmc5311 . . . here's a list of libudev depends and reverse depends in Jessie showing the reach of systemd entanglements. udev is intertwined with systemd and proving to be a big headache to replace. eudev is a drop in replacement but an alternate has to be found as systemd expands its reach and locks things down further.
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Re: The Borg will prevail

Postby cynwulf » January 2nd, 2015, 1:56 pm

bmc5311 wrote:So let me get this straight - as long as I don't install gnome or any gnome dependancies, I'll be unaffected? Or am I reading everything wrong...? Been looking at openbsd, but I'm not excited about setting up the whole enchilada from scratch...

I would suggest filtering some of the hysteria about systemd and deciding if systemd is actually a problem for you. There is a lot of anti systemd sentiment on this forum but if you find that your system still works as before, then perhaps there is no need to jump through hoops and start ripping stuff out to avoid it?

If on the other hand you've read up on it (not FUD and crap blogs and anti systemd sites) and still don't want it, I would suggest just switching to another Linux distribution such as Slackware or gentoo, which still provide a choice or a way to avoid systemd altogether, rather than resorting to the drastic measure of changing to a different operating system.

I switched to *BSD long before the systemd thing blew up - and Debian adopted it as default - and switched away from Debian long before that, so I would not flippantly advise others to switch to a *BSD simply as a means to avoid systemd as there is quite a learning curve and not the same kind of support in terms of user forums. With OpenBSD in particular you are expected to read man pages and make use of the documentation provided rather than asking questions on mailing lists.

If you still want to try out a *BSD, then give FreeBSD a go before switching to OpenBSD or NetBSD as it's simpler to get up and running.
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